airco R12 / R134

[Monza]

Hallo

Ich habe die airco meines Audi 200 Turbo Quattro VFL wieder zu erpressen.
Er hat ein paar Jahre leer stand.

Jetzt muss er wieder aufgefüllt werden. Original Bedürfnisse in R12.
Das darf nicht größer sein scheint, und jetzt müssen R134 oder R143 werden.

Alle reden über das Konvertieren von Sachen, aber ich muss das tun, weil sonst alles zusammenbricht, oder kann sie ohne Konvertierung?

Hat jemand Erfahrungen hat, oder kann mir jemand sagen, darüber?

Niels Mvgr
Niederlande




hello

I have the airco of my Audi 200 Turbo Quattro VFL again extort.
He has a few years stood empty.

Now he must be refilled. Original needs in R12.
That seems to be no more, and now there must be in R134 or R143.

Everyone is talking about converting stuff, but I MUST do that, because otherwise everything breaks down, or can it without conversion??

Has anyone experiences there, or can someone tell me about it?

Niels Mvgr

[Bastian]

If you cannot procure R12 any more, you need to /have to retrofit your system to R134a. Stay away from everything else.
Read the official Audi TSB on how to do that and what parts to use here: http://tech.bentleypublishers.com/servl ... ersion.pdf. What model year is your car? The early systems (model years '84 and '85) are not covered by this.

Grüssle,
Bastian

[Monza]

The license-plat-date of my car is 2 januarie 1986, so its made in 1985.
But i dont know if its made for instance in juli or december.
Its the version with the "new" tachometerhousing, so with the fuelcomputer inbetween the speedometer and tachometer.
Its a vfl, but has the same fuelcomputer-look as the nfl.

What is the problem with just filling mij R12 system with R134 ????

And is it recognizable on the outside of the pump if its retrofited or not ???

And can i recognize the stuff at the filler ?? Can i se if its R12 or R134 ??

greets Niels

[Bastian]

Looks like you have a Mj. '86. To be sure, check your VIN: When it's WAUZZZ44Z F ......, you have an model year 1985, when it's WAUZZZ44Z G ...., you have Mj. 1986. As it says in the document, only the cars from Mj 1986 onwards wich are equipped with compressors from Nippondenso are covered by this TSB. For older ones (with Harrison compressors), you'd need to ask a specialist.
You cannot just fill the system with R134a and leave everything as it is. Lots of reasons (there's tons of material out there on the 'net already). You need to do a proper conversion/retrofit. Period.
If your system is already converted to R134a, there would be stickers around the engine bay, and the service adapters (the filler valves) would be different - any AC shop can tell you that at first glance.

Grüssle,
Bastian

[Monza]

Y called lately a proffesional airco shop, and they told me that the could fill it with R143 (Yes, not a mis-type, not R134).
And when i filled with R143 i dont need a retrofit or something like that.
It was just simply cleaning, filling, ready.

Is that true ??

[Monza]

chassisnumber is: wauzzz44 zga .. . ..

[Franck]

Hi,
you mean R413a. Yes it' true. You can use this refrigerant instead of R134a. The adavantage is that in this case there is no need to change the oil or the washers of the Air-Conditioning. A further advantage is a better cooling than R134a.The desadavantage ist the higher price for the refrigerant.
Greetings
Franck

[Monza]

the price does not make a big difference
160 euro ex vat or 180 with a tracer ex vat
A simple dill with R132 kost also around 130 or 140.

I don't know the exact price of the retrofit job, but i will think it wil get around a 100 euro ???

Than its 240 euro for 132. . . .

And R143 cools better, and i think that this old scool cooling systems need all the capacity it could get to cool in a good way.

greetzzz Niels

[Audi_44Q]

Don't forget to exchange the dryer!! You can get a new dryer for ~45 Euro. It's the alloy round cylinder under the raincover. Also a must is to the reducer; price ~4 Euro. For "reducer" see annex.

[Monza]

4 euro is not a problem
but where is the thing fitted / placed ?

And for that price, isn't it standard to replace it with a refill ???

Dryer must anyway be replaced, or need i say, placed.
Its missing right now.
I missed the pump, its fitted now, and the radiator, fitted now.
Only the dryer must be fitted,

[Bastian]

R413 a (that's the stuff you're talking about, a "drop-in" replacement for R12) contains almost 90% R134a. See specs here: http://www.climalife.dehon.com/uploads/ ... gb-pdf.pdf. You CAN refill your system with that, but I^d still recommend doing it right and retrofitting to R134a. When you don't change the seals, and what with the system having been empty and open for such a long time, my educated guess is that you'll be happier with a proper conversion in the long run. Also, converting properly will make refills (which you'll need much more often due to not changing the seals without converting) easier and cheaper.
The drier is located in front of the evaporator. Audi part no. 443271161A, it costs 114 Euros +VAT at your local Audi parts guy (or you can get it aftermarket...). I'm not attaching an image from the parts catalog due to copyright issues here, but you can easily see where it should go when looking at the schematic drawings in the E T K A.

Grüssle,
Bastian

[Monza]

Hello

Thnaks for answering.
I know where the dryer is fitted.
Thats where i miss a part of the pipes and hoses . . .

But the "reducer" ????
I got no idea where to find it.

[Audi_44Q]

Hello Niels,
the "reducer" is installed in one of the two copper connection lines at the evaporator. Sorry that I don't have a picture here. I'm on a business trip in Morroco. Shit Ramadan.
At the evaporator; where the dryer is also mounted, there are two connection lines. One goes directly to the dryer and the other one is connected to a alloy tube. That is the high pressure side (as I remember) which goes to the front condensor.
When you open this connection, you'll see the "reducer". The arrow must point towards evaporator. See my attached document from yesterday. The picture does not match exactly to Audi 100 and 200 NFL.
Take care when pulling out the old reducer; its fitted with an O-ring for sealing. In my car the Audi dealer managed to fit this reducer opposite in the pipe. The aircon worked for arround three years before the compressor was damaged. Then I exchanged the compressor by myself with a new one and converted to R134a. When I took out the old reduccer, there was a lot of alloy debry from the damaged compressor inside. Therefore I got the complete system washed out, installed the reducer like explained, changed the dryer and connected the new compressor. Now everything is fine.